Andy Mackinnon's guest appearances

Andy Mackinnon

YourForest

The EcoThink Podcast

Dan Thompson

Chris Smith

David Price

Chris Olson

John Nash

Trent Nelson

Greg Wilson

Mark Johnston

Robert Wagner

Seth Klein

Nathan Lauer

Scott Nielsen

Todd Nash

David Andison

Ryan Prosser

OwlTail

John Innes

Garry Merkel

Old Growth. What does that mean? How old is Old? How big is Big? How much is out there? How ecologically unique is it? And finally, how should we interact with it?  It is one of the last natural remnants of a pre-industrialized society. Many relate it to the loss of the great barrier reefs or the shrinking Amazon rainforest.  Why is there still so much conflict and how is it going to be resolved. What does the future of Sustainable Forest Management look like? Today, we seek some answers. Your Forest Podcast by Matthew KristoffOld Growth with John Innes, Andy Mackinnon and Garry MerkelEpisode highlightJohn Innes, Andy Mackinnon and Garry Merkel discuss the importance of old growth forests for ecosystem health. ResourcesA New Future For Old Forests: https://www2.gov.bc.ca/assets/gov/farming-natural-resources-and-industry/forestry/stewardship/old-growth-forests/strategic-review-20200430.pdfBC’s Old Growth Forest: https://sierraclub.bc.ca/wp-content/uploads/bcs-old-growth-forest-a-last-stand-for-biodiversity-report-2020.pdf Review Panel Old Growth Strategy: https://www2.gov.bc.ca/assets/gov/farming-natural-resources-and-industry/forestry/stewardship/old-growth-forests/written-submissions/020_anton-van-walraven.pdf SponsorsWest Fraser: https://www.westfraser.com/ GreenLink Forestry Inc.: http://greenlinkforestry.com/ Damaged Timber: https://www.damagedtimber.com/ GiveawayEnter YourForest10 at checkout at the Damaged Timber store for a 10% discount!Quotes39.48 - 40.02: “Even if the climate weren’t changing, which it most assuredly is, it would probably take you... 1000 or 1500 years to begin to approach the structure of the forest that you’d logged in the first place.” 50.02 - 50.36: “There... [is] a younger generation that is coming through that hopefully will not address biodiversity as being a constraint or maintaining the soil as being a constraint or maintaining clean water supplies as a constraint, they will see these as ecosystem services that simply have to be provided and that the timber that you can maybe get from a forest is the return on the capital that you are investing.” 1.02.35 - 1.02.59: “Our whole way that we learn about forest management right now is from the perspective that forests exist for the benefit of humans, that is our perspective. We don’t... look at them as intrinsic values. We are very self-centred as a species: everything is here for us and - What can we take? How can we maximize the benefit from it?”TakeawaysAndy’s story (6.26)Andy has worked as a forest ecologist since the 1980s and has been involved with ecosystem classification and mapping, and forest research projects characterizing the differences in structure, function and composition of old growth and second growth forests in BC. He has chaired the research and inventory for BC’s old growth strategy and is an advocate of the need to change land use and forest management in the province. John’s story (9.15)John grew up in Scotland and served in the forestry commission, worked in Switzerland for 7 years then moved to BC in 1999, where he is now the Chair of Forest Management at UBC. He has worked on many forest management issues such as the relationships between forestry companies, the government and First Nations. He has advocated for the use of science in decision and policymaking. The variety of opinions got him interested in the old growth debate.Garry’s story (14.23)Garry’s work has been around leveraging land ecology to empower communities to “envision and shape their own futures”. His work in old growth is geared towards managing old growth to ensure the health of the land and the ecosystem. He defines old growth as the stage and age of an ecosystem, be it grassland, marine complex or forest, that has evolved in richness and complexity over time. Not fine to define (22.56)Andy recalls the time when they were grappling with finding the right definition for old growth in the 1990s. They wanted a universally understood definition that could be used for statistics too. Using strictly age-based definitions runs into conflict with inventory-based definitions; neither paint an accurate picture of the ecosystem by themselves. That is compounded by the fact that many lower productivity old growth forests are in protected areas.“You can’t grow old growth” (29.54)Garry explains that iconic ecosystems have spiritual and cultural values associated with them. When components of old growth are lost, so are species and critical functions in the landscape, giving way to the risk of biodiversity loss and disease susceptibility, the maximum risk being at 30% loss of old components. His team suggests deferring harvesting in areas where very few rich ecosystems are left since old growth is not renewable after conventional clear-cutting. A light touch on the landscape (34.25)Garry outlines the differences between the Natural Disturbance Types (NDTs) in various ecosystems. His trick is to use silviculture systems that mimic NDTs and to keep 70% of old growth in a landscape - a paradigm shift he is advocating for. John has noticed a willingness in forestry workers to change their approach, though economists may discourage it. He wonders how to implement these changes in the least disruptive way for maximum progress. Benefits, not the volume of timber (52.25}Andy shares that legislation clearly states that business interests have to be balanced with ecological ones. The land-use plans of larger ecosystems are informed by the risk percentage Garry mentioned. Since land is a public resource, he believes that treaty settlements need to be in place for the revenue and jobs from these to be passed on fairly forward across generations. One consideration is the generation of revenue from the forest without logging it. Who decides what is the best use of land? (1.00.57)In his review with Al Gorley, Garry recommended that the First Nations in BC be more directly involved in making decisions about the land. They have created a system to accommodate the required cut-offs in important metrics, factoring in the constraints. He laments that land management has become a fight for the most concessions, without any invested thinking into land health. Education and increased understanding of proper land management are needed.Land, people, collective wisdom, community (1.09.39)Garry and Al found value in working with indigenous communities, translating the land ethic into land management systems using innovative and practical approaches. He hopes this can be applied at the provincial level in land policy to look at land as a whole, and not manage 1000-year-old ecosystems on 4-year political cycles. Indigenous communities can teach others how to build appropriate systems to connect with and look after the land. “Forestry isn’t rocket science; it’s way more complex than that” (1.19.44)John acknowledges that current forestry education is “still very much old school”, with competencies defined by the professional associations. He and Garry have been working on creating an undergraduate program that imparts necessary skills and knowledge. Andy highlights the complexity of forest management, while Garry notes that managing forests has become more about “translating public expectations into the way our forests look”. “Liars figure and figures lie” (1.27.46)Andy brings to attention the fact that influential people in important positions don’t always agree with the need for change. Provincial governments and indigenous people need to take the lead in enabling change. He discusses generating employment and revenue without logging forests. Garry warns against statistics presented to bring forth a certain point of view, and how that influences public opinion and business strategy. “If you don’t know what’s out there, how can you possibly manage it well?” (1.36.24)John supports a good quality inventory as a way to better manage land use, and Garry suggests a proper classification of old growth for managing the ecosystem. Andy shares the different approaches to creating a professional inventory. Garry recommends factoring in indexes of biodiversity and connectivity along with other metrics. Involving the wisdom of indigenous communities is important since this is “not purely a science exercise”.We have protected areas because we can’t trust ourselves to look after them (1.44.25)Garry advises intensive land management be driven by ecosystem health, using zoning to help us reach the desired state. Andy believes that silvicultural systems should be designed so that the regenerated forest “isn’t 100% different in all aspects from the forests we cut down in the first place”. Garry shares examples of when proper land management has restored the richness of the ecosystem. Old growth is a critical flashpoint (1.55.19)John predicts that climate change is going to lead to an increase in serious forest fires in the interiors, whereas coastal Allowable Annual Cut (AAC) will reduce. Andy is of the opinion that the inherent value of an ecosystem is separate from human value. Garry explains that any approach other than one made considering old growth’s importance in ecosystem health will lead to catastrophe. We Shall overcome (2.06.08)John sees the path forward as being led by indigenous peoples managing the land, even though there will be differences in how each indigenous community wants to use it. Garry and Al’s recommendations to the government have been adopted, and many First Nations organizations have passed resolutions to support them. He believes the transition to applying the suggestions is the hard part, but with adequate support, it can be done. If you liked this podcast, please rate and review it, share it on Instagram and Facebook and tag a friend, and send your feedback and comments to yourforestpodcast@gmail.com.

Old Growth. What does that mean? How old is Old? How big is Big? How much is out there? How ecologically unique is it? And finally, how should we interact with it? It is one of the last natural remnants of a pre-industrialized society. Many relate it to the loss of the great barrier reefs or the shrinking Amazon rainforest. Why is there still so much conflict and how is it going to be resolved. What does the future of Sustainable Forest Management look like? Today, we seek some answers. Your Forest Podcast by Matthew KristoffOld Growth with John Innes, Andy Mackinnon and Garry MerkelEpisode highlightJohn Innes, Andy Mackinnon and Garry Merkel discuss the importance of old growth forests for ecosystem health. ResourcesA New Future For Old Forests: <a href="https://www2.gov.bc.ca/assets/gov/farming-natural-resources-and-industry/forestry/stewardship/old-growth-forests/strategic-review-20200430.pdf" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">https://www2.gov.bc.ca/assets/gov/farming-natural-resources-and-industry/forestry/stewardship/old-growth-forests/strategic-review-20200430.pdf</a>BC’s Old Growth Forest: <a href="https://sierraclub.bc.ca/wp-content/uploads/bcs-old-growth-forest-a-last-stand-for-biodiversity-report-2020.pdf" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">https://sierraclub.bc.ca/wp-content/uploads/bcs-old-growth-forest-a-last-stand-for-biodiversity-report-2020.pdf</a> Review Panel Old Growth Strategy: <a href="https://www2.gov.bc.ca/assets/gov/farming-natural-resources-and-industry/forestry/stewardship/old-growth-forests/written-submissions/020_anton-van-walraven.pdf" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">https://www2.gov.bc.ca/assets/gov/farming-natural-resources-and-industry/forestry/stewardship/old-growth-forests/written-submissions/020_anton-van-walraven.pdf</a> SponsorsWest Fraser: <a href="https://www.westfraser.com/" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">https://www.westfraser.com/</a> GreenLink Forestry Inc.: <a href="http://greenlinkforestry.com/" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">http://greenlinkforestry.com/</a> Damaged Timber: <a href="https://www.damagedtimber.com/" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">https://www.damagedtimber.com/</a> GiveawayEnter YourForest10 at checkout at the Damaged Timber <a href="https://www.damagedtimber.com/store" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">store</a> for a 10% discount!Quotes39.48 - 40.02: “Even if the climate weren’t changing, which it most assuredly is, it would probably take you... 1000 or 1500 years to begin to approach the structure of the forest that you’d logged in the first place.” 50.02 - 50.36: “There... [is] a younger generation that is coming through that hopefully will not address biodiversity as being a constraint or maintaining the soil as being a constraint or maintaining clean water supplies as a constraint, they will see these as ecosystem services that simply have to be provided and that the timber that you can maybe get from a forest is the return on the capital that you are investing.” 1.02.35 - 1.02.59: “Our whole way that we learn about forest management right now is from the perspective that forests exist for the benefit of humans, that is our perspective. We don’t... look at them as intrinsic values. We are very self-centred as a species: everything is here for us and - What can we take? How can we maximize the benefit from it?”TakeawaysAndy’s story (6.26)Andy has worked as a forest ecologist since the 1980s and has been involved with ecosystem classification and mapping, and forest research projects characterizing the differences in structure, function and composition of old growth and second growth forests in BC. He has chaired the research and inventory for BC’s old growth strategy and is an advocate of the need to change land use and forest management in the province. John’s story (9.15)John grew up in Scotland and served in the forestry commission, worked in Switzerland for 7 years then moved to BC in 1999, where he is now the Chair of Forest Management at UBC. He has worked on many forest management issues such as the relationships between forestry companies, the government and First Nations. He has advocated for the use of science in decision and policymaking. The variety of opinions got him interested in the old growth debate.Garry’s story (14.23)Garry’s work has been around leveraging land ecology to empower communities to “envision and shape their own futures”. His work in old growth is geared towards managing old growth to ensure the health of the land and the ecosystem. He defines old growth as the stage and age of an ecosystem, be it grassland, marine complex or forest, that has evolved in richness and complexity over time. Not fine to define (22.56)Andy recalls the time when they were grappling with finding the right definition for old growth in the 1990s. They wanted a universally understood definition that could be used for statistics too. Using strictly age-based definitions runs into conflict with inventory-based definitions; neither paint an accurate picture of the ecosystem by themselves. That is compounded by the fact that many lower productivity old growth forests are in protected areas.“You can’t grow old growth” (29.54)Garry explains that iconic ecosystems have spiritual and cultural values associated with them. When components of old growth are lost, so are species and critical functions in the landscape, giving way to the risk of biodiversity loss and disease susceptibility, the maximum risk being at 30% loss of old components. His team suggests deferring harvesting in areas where very few rich ecosystems are left since old growth is not renewable after conventional clear-cutting. A light touch on the landscape (34.25)Garry outlines the differences between the Natural Disturbance Types (NDTs) in various ecosystems. His trick is to use silviculture systems that mimic NDTs and to keep 70% of old growth in a landscape - a paradigm shift he is advocating for. John has noticed a willingness in forestry workers to change their approach, though economists may discourage it. He wonders how to implement these changes in the least disruptive way for maximum progress. Benefits, not the volume of timber (52.25}Andy shares that legislation clearly states that business interests have to be balanced with ecological ones. The land-use plans of larger ecosystems are informed by the risk percentage Garry mentioned. Since land is a public resource, he believes that treaty settlements need to be in place for the revenue and jobs from these to be passed on fairly forward across generations. One consideration is the generation of revenue from the forest without logging it. Who decides what is the best use of land? (1.00.57)In his review with Al Gorley, Garry recommended that the First Nations in BC be more directly involved in making decisions about the land. They have created a system to accommodate the required cut-offs in important metrics, factoring in the constraints. He laments that land management has become a fight for the most concessions, without any invested thinking into land health. Education and increased understanding of proper land management are needed.Land, people, collective wisdom, community (1.09.39)Garry and Al found value in working with indigenous communities, translating the land ethic into land management systems using innovative and practical approaches. He hopes this can be applied at the provincial level in land policy to look at land as a whole, and not manage 1000-year-old ecosystems on 4-year political cycles. Indigenous communities can teach others how to build appropriate systems to connect with and look after the land. “Forestry isn’t rocket science; it’s way more complex than that” (1.19.44)John acknowledges that current forestry education is “still very much old school”, with competencies defined by the professional associations. He and Garry have been working on creating an undergraduate program that imparts necessary skills and knowledge. Andy highlights the complexity of forest management, while Garry notes that managing forests has become more about “translating public expectations into the way our forests look”. “Liars figure and figures lie” (1.27.46)Andy brings to attention the fact that influential people in important positions don’t always agree with the need for change. Provincial governments and indigenous people need to take the lead in enabling change. He discusses generating employment and revenue without logging forests. Garry warns against statistics presented to bring forth a certain point of view, and how that influences public opinion and business strategy. “If you don’t know what’s out there, how can you possibly manage it well?” (1.36.24)John supports a good quality inventory as a way to better manage land use, and Garry suggests a proper classification of old growth for managing the ecosystem. Andy shares the different approaches to creating a professional inventory. Garry recommends factoring in indexes of biodiversity and connectivity along with other metrics. Involving the wisdom of indigenous communities is important since this is “not purely a science exercise”.We have protected areas because we can’t trust ourselves to look after them (1.44.25)Garry advises intensive land management be driven by ecosystem health, using zoning to help us reach the desired state. Andy believes that silvicultural systems should be designed so that the regenerated forest “isn’t 100% different in all aspects from the forests we cut down in the first place”. Garry shares examples of when proper land management has restored the richness of the ecosystem. Old growth is a critical flashpoint (1.55.19)John predicts that climate change is going to lead to an increase in serious forest fires in the interiors, whereas coastal Allowable Annual Cut (AAC) will reduce. Andy is of the opinion that the inherent value of an ecosystem is separate from human value. Garry explains that any approach other than one made considering old growth’s importance in ecosystem health will lead to catastrophe. We Shall overcome (2.06.08)John sees the path forward as being led by indigenous peoples managing the land, even though there will be differences in how each indigenous community wants to use it. Garry and Al’s recommendations to the government have been adopted, and many First Nations organizations have passed resolutions to support them. He believes the transition to applying the suggestions is the hard part, but with adequate support, it can be done. If you liked this podcast, please rate and review it, share it on <a href="https://www.instagram.com/yourforestpodcast/?hl=en" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">Instagram</a> and <a href="https://www.facebook.com/yourforestpodcast/" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">Facebook</a> and tag a friend, and send your feedback and comments to <a href="mailto:yourforestpodcast@gmail.com">yourforestpodcast@gmail.com</a>.

110-Old Growth with John Innes, Andy Mackinnon and Garry Merkel

In this episode, Maia and Yuko join Dr. Andy MacKinnon in a fascinating discussion about fungi and their role in our ecosystem. As an expert mycologist (mushroom scientist), Dr. MacKinnon shares his knowledge with us on what Fungi are as a group of organisms (surprise, they aren’t closely related to plants at all!), some of their roles in our ecosystems (including the ones that live inside our bodies), and why beneficial fungi are so important for the health of our forests. If you are interested in picking up some of Dr. MacKinnon’s work on mushrooms and plants of the Pacific Northwest, check out the Plants of Coastal British Columbia guidebook: https://www.chapters.indigo.ca/en-ca/books/product/9781772130096-item.html?s_campaign=goo-Shopping_Smart_Books&amp;gclid=CjwKCAjwj6SEBhAOEiwAvFRuKB0GDs5nLUaemTZJUeIVnLGAwa3XG9LXd0P1Cq3o35PIIVGocu5mbRoCjCQQAvD_BwE&amp;gclsrc=aw.ds And if you can’t get enough about mushrooms, go pre-order his Royal BC Museum Handbook “Mushrooms of British Columbia” https://publications.royalbcmuseum.bc.ca/product/mushrooms-of-british-columbia/

In this episode, Maia and Yuko join Dr. Andy MacKinnon in a fascinating discussion about fungi and their role in our ecosystem. As an expert mycologist (mushroom scientist), Dr. MacKinnon shares his knowledge with us on what Fungi are as a group of organisms (surprise, they aren’t closely related to plants at all!), some of their roles in our ecosystems (including the ones that live inside our bodies), and why beneficial fungi are so important for the health of our forests. If you are interested in picking up some of Dr. MacKinnon’s work on mushrooms and plants of the Pacific Northwest, check out the Plants of Coastal British Columbia guidebook: <a href="https://www.chapters.indigo.ca/en-ca/books/product/9781772130096-item.html?s_campaign=goo-Shopping_Smart_Books&amp;gclid=CjwKCAjwj6SEBhAOEiwAvFRuKB0GDs5nLUaemTZJUeIVnLGAwa3XG9LXd0P1Cq3o35PIIVGocu5mbRoCjCQQAvD_BwE&amp;gclsrc=aw.ds" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">https://www.chapters.indigo.ca/en-ca/books/product/9781772130096-item.html?s_campaign=goo-Shopping_Smart_Books&amp;gclid=CjwKCAjwj6SEBhAOEiwAvFRuKB0GDs5nLUaemTZJUeIVnLGAwa3XG9LXd0P1Cq3o35PIIVGocu5mbRoCjCQQAvD_BwE&amp;gclsrc=aw.ds</a> And if you can’t get enough about mushrooms, go pre-order his Royal BC Museum Handbook “Mushrooms of British Columbia” <a href="https://publications.royalbcmuseum.bc.ca/product/mushrooms-of-british-columbia/" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">https://publications.royalbcmuseum.bc.ca/product/mushrooms-of-british-columbia/</a>

Episode 9 - Interview with Dr. Andy MacKinnon on Fungi and Their Role in Our Ecosystem