Garry Merkel's guest appearances

Garry Merkel

YourForest

TimberConnect 

Dan Thompson

Chris Smith

David Price

Chris Olson

John Nash

Trent Nelson

Greg Wilson

Mark Johnston

Robert Wagner

Jennifer Gunter

Nathan Lauer

Scott Nielsen

Todd Nash

David Andison

Ryan Prosser

OwlTail

Curious to know more about Old Growth Management? Meet Dr. Garry Merkel, Co-Author of “A New Future for Old Forests” a strategic review of old-growth management in BC.The strategic review was the largest outreach of its kind in BC Forestry history, consulting with over 800 individuals personally and thousands more through their survey. Join TimberConnect as we learn about the results and recommendations of this report straight from the source.To read the report visit https://www2.gov.bc.ca/gov/content/industry/forestry/managing-our-forest-resources/old-growth-forestsView the TimberConnect Job Board and apply at https://jobs.timberconnect.ca/Join the TimberConnect community by visiting https://linktr.ee/TimberConnect

Curious to know more about Old Growth Management? Meet Dr. Garry Merkel, Co-Author of “A New Future for Old Forests” a strategic review of old-growth management in BC.The strategic review was the largest outreach of its kind in BC Forestry history, consulting with over 800 individuals personally and thousands more through their survey. Join TimberConnect as we learn about the results and recommendations of this report straight from the source.To read the report visit <a href="https://www2.gov.bc.ca/gov/content/industry/forestry/managing-our-forest-resources/old-growth-forests" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">https://www2.gov.bc.ca/gov/content/industry/forestry/managing-our-forest-resources/old-growth-forests</a>View the TimberConnect Job Board and apply at <a href="https://jobs.timberconnect.ca/" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">https://jobs.timberconnect.ca/</a>Join the TimberConnect community by visiting <a href="https://linktr.ee/TimberConnect" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">https://linktr.ee/TimberConnect</a>

Understanding Old Growth with Garry Merkel, RPF, DSc hc

Any chance I get to pick this guy’s brain I do it! Garry has spent decades considering the clashing of two cultures, Indigenous and western culture, and how the miscommunication between them has built up barriers that are difficult to break through. Garry lays out his experience, as an Indigenous person, and as a forester, regarding the past present and future of land management, communication, and collaboration. He explains the earth-based land ethic held by many First Nations cultures, and how this land ethic may be the answer to many of our questions, or at the very least worth considering.Episode highlightGarry Merkel speaks about the role that earth-based land management practice plays in restoring ecosystem integrity and health.ResourcesStudies discussed by Garry in this episode regarding moose browse;The exceptional value of intact forest ecosystemshttps://www.researchgate.net/publication/323399911_The_exceptional_value_of_intact_forest_ecosystemsRoads and their major ecological effectshttps://www.annualreviews.org/doi/abs/10.1146/annurev.ecolsys.29.1.207Nutritional Quality and Tannin Astringency of Browse in Clear-Cuts and Old-Growth Forestshttps://www.researchgate.net/publication/271694789_Nutritional_Quality_and_Tannin_Astringency_of_Browse_in_Clear-Cuts_and_Old-Growth_ForestsReconciliation with Garry Merkel: https://yourforestpodcast.com/episode-1/2021/11/29/btlw1dfftblgwjopr1bsspxc8zveltSponsorsWest Fraser: https://www.westfraser.com/ GreenLink Forestry Inc.: http://greenlinkforestry.com/ Damaged Timber: https://www.damagedtimber.com/ GiveawayEnter YourForest10 at checkout at the Damaged Timber store for a 10% discount!Quotes1.21.10 - 1.21.20: “The likelihood of you being earth-centered increases significantly when you understand that your survival is completely dependent on taking care of the earth.” TakeawaysPublic expectation (06.44)Garry explains how the role of the forester has expanded over the years to address too many issues, including economic demands. This has contributed to the loss of ecosystem function and biodiversity. Industrial Forestry (10.54)Garry talks about how the negative effects of large-scale industrial forestry in BC have only been recognized in the last few decades. Clear Cuts (19.45)Garry points out that the primary harvesting system in BC is clear-cutting which sets the ecosystem back because of the amount of disturbance. Learning the hard way (26.38)Garry claims that our society is now making different choices after seeing the impact of past choices. Synergistic land care (34.44)Garry highlights how New Zealand, Australia and a town in Wisconsin have modified their land management systems to align with the indigenous land ethic. Radical regenerative forestry (41.16)Garry shares about groups who are working on regenerative forestry to restore the health of the ecosystem by shutting down industrial activities for a while. Indigenous ethic (45.46)Garry is working with UBC to create an indigenous land center to gather and document the earth-centered land ethic. Outcome, not output (1.00.05)Garry says that we need to be very conscious of cost and efficiency so that we can afford to conduct sustainable land management. Relationship plans (1.10.27)Garry, as a scientist, has found many instances where indigenous knowledge has “turned out to be way more valuable than scientific knowledge”. Earth at the core (1.17.50)Garry dispels the myths that earth-centered management is uniquely indigenous and that all indigenous groups have it. Caring for the land (1.24.38)Garry is a strong supporter of how earth-centered ideologies are translating to land stewardship systems, some of which are pragmatic and economically effective. Nature is unpredictable (1.34.15)Garry states that you are doomed to frustration if you assume that nature is predictable. Positive change (1.39.44)Garry’s way is to educate and engage all the relevant parties, bring in the best scientists and foster a covenant with everyone to achieve the best outcomes possible. If you liked this podcast, please rate and review it, share it on Instagram and Facebook and tag a friend, and send your feedback and comments to yourforestpodcast@gmail.com.

Any chance I get to pick this guy’s brain I do it! Garry has spent decades considering the clashing of two cultures, Indigenous and western culture, and how the miscommunication between them has built up barriers that are difficult to break through. Garry lays out his experience, as an Indigenous person, and as a forester, regarding the past present and future of land management, communication, and collaboration. He explains the earth-based land ethic held by many First Nations cultures, and how this land ethic may be the answer to many of our questions, or at the very least worth considering.Episode highlightGarry Merkel speaks about the role that earth-based land management practice plays in restoring ecosystem integrity and health.ResourcesStudies discussed by Garry in this episode regarding moose browse;The exceptional value of intact forest ecosystems<a href="https://www.researchgate.net/publication/323399911_The_exceptional_value_of_intact_forest_ecosystems" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">https://www.researchgate.net/publication/323399911_The_exceptional_value_of_intact_forest_ecosystems</a>Roads and their major ecological effects<a href="https://www.annualreviews.org/doi/abs/10.1146/annurev.ecolsys.29.1.207" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">https://www.annualreviews.org/doi/abs/10.1146/annurev.ecolsys.29.1.207</a>Nutritional Quality and Tannin Astringency of Browse in Clear-Cuts and Old-Growth Forests<a href="https://www.researchgate.net/publication/271694789_Nutritional_Quality_and_Tannin_Astringency_of_Browse_in_Clear-Cuts_and_Old-Growth_Forests" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">https://www.researchgate.net/publication/271694789_Nutritional_Quality_and_Tannin_Astringency_of_Browse_in_Clear-Cuts_and_Old-Growth_Forests</a>Reconciliation with Garry Merkel: <a href="https://yourforestpodcast.com/episode-1/2021/11/29/btlw1dfftblgwjopr1bsspxc8zvelt" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">https://yourforestpodcast.com/episode-1/2021/11/29/btlw1dfftblgwjopr1bsspxc8zvelt</a>SponsorsWest Fraser: <a href="https://www.westfraser.com/" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">https://www.westfraser.com/</a> GreenLink Forestry Inc.: <a href="http://greenlinkforestry.com/" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">http://greenlinkforestry.com/</a> Damaged Timber: <a href="https://www.damagedtimber.com/" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">https://www.damagedtimber.com/</a> GiveawayEnter YourForest10 at checkout at the Damaged Timber <a href="https://www.damagedtimber.com/store" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">store</a> for a 10% discount!Quotes1.21.10 - 1.21.20: “The likelihood of you being earth-centered increases significantly when you understand that your survival is completely dependent on taking care of the earth.” TakeawaysPublic expectation (06.44)Garry explains how the role of the forester has expanded over the years to address too many issues, including economic demands. This has contributed to the loss of ecosystem function and biodiversity. Industrial Forestry (10.54)Garry talks about how the negative effects of large-scale industrial forestry in BC have only been recognized in the last few decades. Clear Cuts (19.45)Garry points out that the primary harvesting system in BC is clear-cutting which sets the ecosystem back because of the amount of disturbance. Learning the hard way (26.38)Garry claims that our society is now making different choices after seeing the impact of past choices. Synergistic land care (34.44)Garry highlights how New Zealand, Australia and a town in Wisconsin have modified their land management systems to align with the indigenous land ethic. Radical regenerative forestry (41.16)Garry shares about groups who are working on regenerative forestry to restore the health of the ecosystem by shutting down industrial activities for a while. Indigenous ethic (45.46)Garry is working with UBC to create an indigenous land center to gather and document the earth-centered land ethic. Outcome, not output (1.00.05)Garry says that we need to be very conscious of cost and efficiency so that we can afford to conduct sustainable land management. Relationship plans (1.10.27)Garry, as a scientist, has found many instances where indigenous knowledge has “turned out to be way more valuable than scientific knowledge”. Earth at the core (1.17.50)Garry dispels the myths that earth-centered management is uniquely indigenous and that all indigenous groups have it. Caring for the land (1.24.38)Garry is a strong supporter of how earth-centered ideologies are translating to land stewardship systems, some of which are pragmatic and economically effective. Nature is unpredictable (1.34.15)Garry states that you are doomed to frustration if you assume that nature is predictable. Positive change (1.39.44)Garry’s way is to educate and engage all the relevant parties, bring in the best scientists and foster a covenant with everyone to achieve the best outcomes possible. If you liked this podcast, please rate and review it, share it on <a href="https://www.instagram.com/yourforestpodcast/?hl=en" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">Instagram</a> and <a href="https://www.facebook.com/yourforestpodcast/" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">Facebook</a> and tag a friend, and send your feedback and comments to <a href="mailto:yourforestpodcast@gmail.com">yourforestpodcast@gmail.com</a>.

117-Earth-Based Land Management with Garry Merkel

John Innes

Andy Mackinnon

Old Growth. What does that mean? How old is Old? How big is Big? How much is out there? How ecologically unique is it? And finally, how should we interact with it?  It is one of the last natural remnants of a pre-industrialized society. Many relate it to the loss of the great barrier reefs or the shrinking Amazon rainforest.  Why is there still so much conflict and how is it going to be resolved. What does the future of Sustainable Forest Management look like? Today, we seek some answers. Your Forest Podcast by Matthew KristoffOld Growth with John Innes, Andy Mackinnon and Garry MerkelEpisode highlightJohn Innes, Andy Mackinnon and Garry Merkel discuss the importance of old growth forests for ecosystem health. ResourcesA New Future For Old Forests: https://www2.gov.bc.ca/assets/gov/farming-natural-resources-and-industry/forestry/stewardship/old-growth-forests/strategic-review-20200430.pdfBC’s Old Growth Forest: https://sierraclub.bc.ca/wp-content/uploads/bcs-old-growth-forest-a-last-stand-for-biodiversity-report-2020.pdf Review Panel Old Growth Strategy: https://www2.gov.bc.ca/assets/gov/farming-natural-resources-and-industry/forestry/stewardship/old-growth-forests/written-submissions/020_anton-van-walraven.pdf SponsorsWest Fraser: https://www.westfraser.com/ GreenLink Forestry Inc.: http://greenlinkforestry.com/ Damaged Timber: https://www.damagedtimber.com/ GiveawayEnter YourForest10 at checkout at the Damaged Timber store for a 10% discount!Quotes39.48 - 40.02: “Even if the climate weren’t changing, which it most assuredly is, it would probably take you... 1000 or 1500 years to begin to approach the structure of the forest that you’d logged in the first place.” 50.02 - 50.36: “There... [is] a younger generation that is coming through that hopefully will not address biodiversity as being a constraint or maintaining the soil as being a constraint or maintaining clean water supplies as a constraint, they will see these as ecosystem services that simply have to be provided and that the timber that you can maybe get from a forest is the return on the capital that you are investing.” 1.02.35 - 1.02.59: “Our whole way that we learn about forest management right now is from the perspective that forests exist for the benefit of humans, that is our perspective. We don’t... look at them as intrinsic values. We are very self-centred as a species: everything is here for us and - What can we take? How can we maximize the benefit from it?”TakeawaysAndy’s story (6.26)Andy has worked as a forest ecologist since the 1980s and has been involved with ecosystem classification and mapping, and forest research projects characterizing the differences in structure, function and composition of old growth and second growth forests in BC. He has chaired the research and inventory for BC’s old growth strategy and is an advocate of the need to change land use and forest management in the province. John’s story (9.15)John grew up in Scotland and served in the forestry commission, worked in Switzerland for 7 years then moved to BC in 1999, where he is now the Chair of Forest Management at UBC. He has worked on many forest management issues such as the relationships between forestry companies, the government and First Nations. He has advocated for the use of science in decision and policymaking. The variety of opinions got him interested in the old growth debate.Garry’s story (14.23)Garry’s work has been around leveraging land ecology to empower communities to “envision and shape their own futures”. His work in old growth is geared towards managing old growth to ensure the health of the land and the ecosystem. He defines old growth as the stage and age of an ecosystem, be it grassland, marine complex or forest, that has evolved in richness and complexity over time. Not fine to define (22.56)Andy recalls the time when they were grappling with finding the right definition for old growth in the 1990s. They wanted a universally understood definition that could be used for statistics too. Using strictly age-based definitions runs into conflict with inventory-based definitions; neither paint an accurate picture of the ecosystem by themselves. That is compounded by the fact that many lower productivity old growth forests are in protected areas.“You can’t grow old growth” (29.54)Garry explains that iconic ecosystems have spiritual and cultural values associated with them. When components of old growth are lost, so are species and critical functions in the landscape, giving way to the risk of biodiversity loss and disease susceptibility, the maximum risk being at 30% loss of old components. His team suggests deferring harvesting in areas where very few rich ecosystems are left since old growth is not renewable after conventional clear-cutting. A light touch on the landscape (34.25)Garry outlines the differences between the Natural Disturbance Types (NDTs) in various ecosystems. His trick is to use silviculture systems that mimic NDTs and to keep 70% of old growth in a landscape - a paradigm shift he is advocating for. John has noticed a willingness in forestry workers to change their approach, though economists may discourage it. He wonders how to implement these changes in the least disruptive way for maximum progress. Benefits, not the volume of timber (52.25}Andy shares that legislation clearly states that business interests have to be balanced with ecological ones. The land-use plans of larger ecosystems are informed by the risk percentage Garry mentioned. Since land is a public resource, he believes that treaty settlements need to be in place for the revenue and jobs from these to be passed on fairly forward across generations. One consideration is the generation of revenue from the forest without logging it. Who decides what is the best use of land? (1.00.57)In his review with Al Gorley, Garry recommended that the First Nations in BC be more directly involved in making decisions about the land. They have created a system to accommodate the required cut-offs in important metrics, factoring in the constraints. He laments that land management has become a fight for the most concessions, without any invested thinking into land health. Education and increased understanding of proper land management are needed.Land, people, collective wisdom, community (1.09.39)Garry and Al found value in working with indigenous communities, translating the land ethic into land management systems using innovative and practical approaches. He hopes this can be applied at the provincial level in land policy to look at land as a whole, and not manage 1000-year-old ecosystems on 4-year political cycles. Indigenous communities can teach others how to build appropriate systems to connect with and look after the land. “Forestry isn’t rocket science; it’s way more complex than that” (1.19.44)John acknowledges that current forestry education is “still very much old school”, with competencies defined by the professional associations. He and Garry have been working on creating an undergraduate program that imparts necessary skills and knowledge. Andy highlights the complexity of forest management, while Garry notes that managing forests has become more about “translating public expectations into the way our forests look”. “Liars figure and figures lie” (1.27.46)Andy brings to attention the fact that influential people in important positions don’t always agree with the need for change. Provincial governments and indigenous people need to take the lead in enabling change. He discusses generating employment and revenue without logging forests. Garry warns against statistics presented to bring forth a certain point of view, and how that influences public opinion and business strategy. “If you don’t know what’s out there, how can you possibly manage it well?” (1.36.24)John supports a good quality inventory as a way to better manage land use, and Garry suggests a proper classification of old growth for managing the ecosystem. Andy shares the different approaches to creating a professional inventory. Garry recommends factoring in indexes of biodiversity and connectivity along with other metrics. Involving the wisdom of indigenous communities is important since this is “not purely a science exercise”.We have protected areas because we can’t trust ourselves to look after them (1.44.25)Garry advises intensive land management be driven by ecosystem health, using zoning to help us reach the desired state. Andy believes that silvicultural systems should be designed so that the regenerated forest “isn’t 100% different in all aspects from the forests we cut down in the first place”. Garry shares examples of when proper land management has restored the richness of the ecosystem. Old growth is a critical flashpoint (1.55.19)John predicts that climate change is going to lead to an increase in serious forest fires in the interiors, whereas coastal Allowable Annual Cut (AAC) will reduce. Andy is of the opinion that the inherent value of an ecosystem is separate from human value. Garry explains that any approach other than one made considering old growth’s importance in ecosystem health will lead to catastrophe. We Shall overcome (2.06.08)John sees the path forward as being led by indigenous peoples managing the land, even though there will be differences in how each indigenous community wants to use it. Garry and Al’s recommendations to the government have been adopted, and many First Nations organizations have passed resolutions to support them. He believes the transition to applying the suggestions is the hard part, but with adequate support, it can be done. If you liked this podcast, please rate and review it, share it on Instagram and Facebook and tag a friend, and send your feedback and comments to yourforestpodcast@gmail.com.

Old Growth. What does that mean? How old is Old? How big is Big? How much is out there? How ecologically unique is it? And finally, how should we interact with it? It is one of the last natural remnants of a pre-industrialized society. Many relate it to the loss of the great barrier reefs or the shrinking Amazon rainforest. Why is there still so much conflict and how is it going to be resolved. What does the future of Sustainable Forest Management look like? Today, we seek some answers. Your Forest Podcast by Matthew KristoffOld Growth with John Innes, Andy Mackinnon and Garry MerkelEpisode highlightJohn Innes, Andy Mackinnon and Garry Merkel discuss the importance of old growth forests for ecosystem health. ResourcesA New Future For Old Forests: <a href="https://www2.gov.bc.ca/assets/gov/farming-natural-resources-and-industry/forestry/stewardship/old-growth-forests/strategic-review-20200430.pdf" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">https://www2.gov.bc.ca/assets/gov/farming-natural-resources-and-industry/forestry/stewardship/old-growth-forests/strategic-review-20200430.pdf</a>BC’s Old Growth Forest: <a href="https://sierraclub.bc.ca/wp-content/uploads/bcs-old-growth-forest-a-last-stand-for-biodiversity-report-2020.pdf" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">https://sierraclub.bc.ca/wp-content/uploads/bcs-old-growth-forest-a-last-stand-for-biodiversity-report-2020.pdf</a> Review Panel Old Growth Strategy: <a href="https://www2.gov.bc.ca/assets/gov/farming-natural-resources-and-industry/forestry/stewardship/old-growth-forests/written-submissions/020_anton-van-walraven.pdf" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">https://www2.gov.bc.ca/assets/gov/farming-natural-resources-and-industry/forestry/stewardship/old-growth-forests/written-submissions/020_anton-van-walraven.pdf</a> SponsorsWest Fraser: <a href="https://www.westfraser.com/" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">https://www.westfraser.com/</a> GreenLink Forestry Inc.: <a href="http://greenlinkforestry.com/" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">http://greenlinkforestry.com/</a> Damaged Timber: <a href="https://www.damagedtimber.com/" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">https://www.damagedtimber.com/</a> GiveawayEnter YourForest10 at checkout at the Damaged Timber <a href="https://www.damagedtimber.com/store" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">store</a> for a 10% discount!Quotes39.48 - 40.02: “Even if the climate weren’t changing, which it most assuredly is, it would probably take you... 1000 or 1500 years to begin to approach the structure of the forest that you’d logged in the first place.” 50.02 - 50.36: “There... [is] a younger generation that is coming through that hopefully will not address biodiversity as being a constraint or maintaining the soil as being a constraint or maintaining clean water supplies as a constraint, they will see these as ecosystem services that simply have to be provided and that the timber that you can maybe get from a forest is the return on the capital that you are investing.” 1.02.35 - 1.02.59: “Our whole way that we learn about forest management right now is from the perspective that forests exist for the benefit of humans, that is our perspective. We don’t... look at them as intrinsic values. We are very self-centred as a species: everything is here for us and - What can we take? How can we maximize the benefit from it?”TakeawaysAndy’s story (6.26)Andy has worked as a forest ecologist since the 1980s and has been involved with ecosystem classification and mapping, and forest research projects characterizing the differences in structure, function and composition of old growth and second growth forests in BC. He has chaired the research and inventory for BC’s old growth strategy and is an advocate of the need to change land use and forest management in the province. John’s story (9.15)John grew up in Scotland and served in the forestry commission, worked in Switzerland for 7 years then moved to BC in 1999, where he is now the Chair of Forest Management at UBC. He has worked on many forest management issues such as the relationships between forestry companies, the government and First Nations. He has advocated for the use of science in decision and policymaking. The variety of opinions got him interested in the old growth debate.Garry’s story (14.23)Garry’s work has been around leveraging land ecology to empower communities to “envision and shape their own futures”. His work in old growth is geared towards managing old growth to ensure the health of the land and the ecosystem. He defines old growth as the stage and age of an ecosystem, be it grassland, marine complex or forest, that has evolved in richness and complexity over time. Not fine to define (22.56)Andy recalls the time when they were grappling with finding the right definition for old growth in the 1990s. They wanted a universally understood definition that could be used for statistics too. Using strictly age-based definitions runs into conflict with inventory-based definitions; neither paint an accurate picture of the ecosystem by themselves. That is compounded by the fact that many lower productivity old growth forests are in protected areas.“You can’t grow old growth” (29.54)Garry explains that iconic ecosystems have spiritual and cultural values associated with them. When components of old growth are lost, so are species and critical functions in the landscape, giving way to the risk of biodiversity loss and disease susceptibility, the maximum risk being at 30% loss of old components. His team suggests deferring harvesting in areas where very few rich ecosystems are left since old growth is not renewable after conventional clear-cutting. A light touch on the landscape (34.25)Garry outlines the differences between the Natural Disturbance Types (NDTs) in various ecosystems. His trick is to use silviculture systems that mimic NDTs and to keep 70% of old growth in a landscape - a paradigm shift he is advocating for. John has noticed a willingness in forestry workers to change their approach, though economists may discourage it. He wonders how to implement these changes in the least disruptive way for maximum progress. Benefits, not the volume of timber (52.25}Andy shares that legislation clearly states that business interests have to be balanced with ecological ones. The land-use plans of larger ecosystems are informed by the risk percentage Garry mentioned. Since land is a public resource, he believes that treaty settlements need to be in place for the revenue and jobs from these to be passed on fairly forward across generations. One consideration is the generation of revenue from the forest without logging it. Who decides what is the best use of land? (1.00.57)In his review with Al Gorley, Garry recommended that the First Nations in BC be more directly involved in making decisions about the land. They have created a system to accommodate the required cut-offs in important metrics, factoring in the constraints. He laments that land management has become a fight for the most concessions, without any invested thinking into land health. Education and increased understanding of proper land management are needed.Land, people, collective wisdom, community (1.09.39)Garry and Al found value in working with indigenous communities, translating the land ethic into land management systems using innovative and practical approaches. He hopes this can be applied at the provincial level in land policy to look at land as a whole, and not manage 1000-year-old ecosystems on 4-year political cycles. Indigenous communities can teach others how to build appropriate systems to connect with and look after the land. “Forestry isn’t rocket science; it’s way more complex than that” (1.19.44)John acknowledges that current forestry education is “still very much old school”, with competencies defined by the professional associations. He and Garry have been working on creating an undergraduate program that imparts necessary skills and knowledge. Andy highlights the complexity of forest management, while Garry notes that managing forests has become more about “translating public expectations into the way our forests look”. “Liars figure and figures lie” (1.27.46)Andy brings to attention the fact that influential people in important positions don’t always agree with the need for change. Provincial governments and indigenous people need to take the lead in enabling change. He discusses generating employment and revenue without logging forests. Garry warns against statistics presented to bring forth a certain point of view, and how that influences public opinion and business strategy. “If you don’t know what’s out there, how can you possibly manage it well?” (1.36.24)John supports a good quality inventory as a way to better manage land use, and Garry suggests a proper classification of old growth for managing the ecosystem. Andy shares the different approaches to creating a professional inventory. Garry recommends factoring in indexes of biodiversity and connectivity along with other metrics. Involving the wisdom of indigenous communities is important since this is “not purely a science exercise”.We have protected areas because we can’t trust ourselves to look after them (1.44.25)Garry advises intensive land management be driven by ecosystem health, using zoning to help us reach the desired state. Andy believes that silvicultural systems should be designed so that the regenerated forest “isn’t 100% different in all aspects from the forests we cut down in the first place”. Garry shares examples of when proper land management has restored the richness of the ecosystem. Old growth is a critical flashpoint (1.55.19)John predicts that climate change is going to lead to an increase in serious forest fires in the interiors, whereas coastal Allowable Annual Cut (AAC) will reduce. Andy is of the opinion that the inherent value of an ecosystem is separate from human value. Garry explains that any approach other than one made considering old growth’s importance in ecosystem health will lead to catastrophe. We Shall overcome (2.06.08)John sees the path forward as being led by indigenous peoples managing the land, even though there will be differences in how each indigenous community wants to use it. Garry and Al’s recommendations to the government have been adopted, and many First Nations organizations have passed resolutions to support them. He believes the transition to applying the suggestions is the hard part, but with adequate support, it can be done. If you liked this podcast, please rate and review it, share it on <a href="https://www.instagram.com/yourforestpodcast/?hl=en" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">Instagram</a> and <a href="https://www.facebook.com/yourforestpodcast/" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">Facebook</a> and tag a friend, and send your feedback and comments to <a href="mailto:yourforestpodcast@gmail.com">yourforestpodcast@gmail.com</a>.

110-Old Growth with John Innes, Andy Mackinnon and Garry Merkel